In this episode
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Ayurveda and yoga are two halves of one path to well-being, and yoga teacher and Ayurvedic practitioner Akshay Bhat explores the four pillars of life in Ayurveda: Dharma (righteousness), Artha (material possessions), Kama (fulfillment of desires), and Moksha (liberation).
He emphasizes that balancing these aspects is crucial to leading a happy and healthy life. Akshay delves into how Ayurveda and yoga are interconnected, with both practices supporting spiritual growth and well-being.
Ayurveda, which dates back over 6,000 years, is not just a system for physical health but also a guide for living a purposeful life. The speakers discuss how disease is viewed as a "mistake of intelligence" in Ayurveda, and how balance across the four life pillars is key to achieving wellness.
The concept of Dharma is explored, contrasting it with Adharma, which represents a life driven by ego and negative emotions. The importance of balancing material and spiritual needs, or Artha, is highlighted, with the caution that modern society often promotes unnecessary desires. Finally, Moksha, or liberation, is discussed, with the speakers suggesting that it can be found through various activities like yoga, meditation, and creative pursuits. Each person’s path to freedom is unique, and discovering what brings a sense of expansion is essential for personal growth.
Akshay’s Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/akshaybhatyoga/
The IN Movement Podcast was formerly the Going Pro Yoga Podcast — and before that, the Yoga Teacher Evolution Podcast and the Rat Race Rebellion Podcast. Same mission, evolved name.
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Hey there, before we get started on this week's episode, I would love to ask for your support by reviewing this podcast. We want to share yoga with as many people as possible and this free resource, this podcast is one of the ways that we can do that. And the best way that you can help support us is by giving us a review.
So if you go to Apple Podcast or Spotify or whatever podcast platform you use, Scroll down until you find that star review and then give us some love. Thank you so much. And let's get started with this week's episode. Ayurveda says basically there is 4 means of life, Dharma, artha, Kama and moksha. These are the four means of life. So following Dharma, Dharma means righteousness. What is right which creates balance between oneself, one inner self and outer self, outer
environment and artha means possession of material things and karma, fulfillment of the desires and moksha means liberation. So every individual have to understand you know what part of Dharma that I am missing in where I am caught into. So balance of this 4 means of life leads us into a happy healthy life.
Welcome to the Going Pro Yoga podcast. If you love yoga as much as I do then this podcast is for you. We talk all things yoga related. For teachers. In order to supplement and complement and even support after a 200 hour yoga teacher training.
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Welcome to our podcast. Hello, good. Morning. Good afternoon, good evening. Depending on where you are in the world, this is Michael Henry, the host of the Going Pro Yoga podcast. And I just want to introduce this week's episode with Akshay Bhat. So Akshay has been actually on the podcast before. He's an Indian man who moved to Bali and has been working in teacher trainings here in teaching yoga, philosophy, as well as other things in several trainings on the island. So if you want to learn a little
bit more about Akshay, we do actually have a, a bio episode, more or less episode 138, Healing through tradition with Akshay Bhat. He talks a lot about his upbringing and mantras and very interesting story. So I definitely, if you haven't listened to that one, tune into that one. And then the the episodes after that, 1:39 and 1:40, he talks more about the, the sutras, Patanjali's sutras. And then also just cultivating healthy habits and spiritual growth.
So great little episodes there. And then for today, today we're gonna actually having Akshay come back in to talk about Ayurveda. So Ayurveda is a life science ultimately is what it translates to, and it's such a beautiful and deep conversation about basically life science that has existed for a long, long time, kind of alongside yoga.
So it's very interesting to connect the two and very exciting to have this on the podcast this week. So this is going to be actually a two-part episode. So this will be episode 1 and then the episode will split and continue the following week. So without further ado.
Let me introduce this week's episode with Akshay Bot on Ayurveda. And the episode is going to start with a gentle mantra, Guru mantra that Akshay will lead us through. So sit in a comfortable seated position if you'd like and you'd like to dial in and connect with yourself as Akshay serenades us with his beautiful voice.
Enjoy. Guru Mantra as my Sri Gurave namaha Gur Brahmaha Gurur Vishnu Gurudevo Maheshwara Guru Saksha parabraha. Thank you. Thank. You welcome to the podcast, to those that are tuning in. And we have a returning guest, Akshay Bhatt, who is here to bless us with his presence, beautiful voice in his knowledge of mantras serenading us just now.
And yeah, we're I'm excited actually for today because we're going to talk about Ayurveda, kind of just break that down a little bit and kind of dive into it. I know that some people learn a little bit about it and they kind of get excited to find out, you know, what they are, what's, you know, pita bata, kafa, fire and all these things and kind of what it all means. So yeah, I mean, Akshaya's been on the podcast before. We'll.
We'll put a few. Of the episodes in the show notes, if you want to listen. But maybe just a quick little background on who you are and where you're from. But you're obviously from India. Yeah. And you studied in a gurukula, which is my understanding, just to be like a yoga boot camp. Yeah, absolutely.
When you're younger and, you know, basically like an all boys yoga school, like 80, I think you said at one point. And yeah, your background is very much in the yoga therapy and, and also mantras. I think it's kind of intertwined with your family and, and it's one of your passions and your love. So yeah.
But for today, yeah, we're going to go into Ayurveda, which I think is something that is you're also excited to to learn more about and also share. And that's kind of why we have you on the podcast today. So welcome. Thank you for having me, I'm very excited too.
Yeah, great. So I know a little bit about Ayurveda, but if if I were to ask you like what is a good thing to start with when we think about like what is Ayurveda and first of all, maybe what is the history of it? Like where did it kind of originate from?
Where did it come from? So first of all I am a student of Ayurveda. I recently started studying Ayurveda like a year ago. Like took it professionally seriously and started doing a course on Ayurveda. So Ayurveda is actually a sister of yoga because Ayurveda deals with whole like a holistic lifestyle where yoga is dealing with the practice. And if you see the history of Ayurveda, it's same as yoga. So yoga and Ayurveda, they are like born out of the same civilization, Saraswati Valley
civilization in history books we read as Indus Valley civilization. So about more than I think 6000 years ago. And if you see the the Ayurvedas mentioned is in the Vedas, it is one of the part of the Veda, Atharva Veda and Ayurveda is a subdivision of Atharva Veda.
So Ayurveda actually if you see the word Ayurveda which means a science of life, Ayur means life, Veda means science or a knowledge. So which gives us the knowledge of life. So how to live life, what are the means of life and how do we live this life more holistically, more connected to divinity.
So this is what is Ayurveda is like explaining us basically that how we can live this life very purposefully and very holistically. And it's been around basically as far back as yoga. So you saying that it's a sister? It's almost kind of like it came forth in that same way. And I forget his name, but the grandfather of yoga, basically. Patanjali.
Patanjali he was He was a specialist in Ayurveda as well. Yes, so Patanjali is, is a master of Sanskrit grammar and Ayurveda and also yoga. So if we see, we really don't know whether it's the same Patanjali or it, it is different, different Patanjali. And also some of the scholars say Patanjali is like a, is like a post, like a, you know, like a throne. A learned scholar sits there and then he leads this throne. But we actually don't know Patanjali is the same Patanjali. But as we see the reference
point with the scripture we can say Patanjali is also one of the scholar of Ayurveda. But basically the father of Ayurveda is Charaka and there is lots of text available, Charaka Samhita and Ashtanga Rudaya and earlier days there were main lots of texts available which is now not available.
So maybe around 4:00 to 5:00 important texts to study the Ayurveda. So now when you're studying Ayurveda, is that what you're kind of reading into some of these, yes. Or are there more modern texts that or combination maybe? Yes.
So these days if we actually want to study Ayurveda, basically we have to get introduced to this subject. So there is like Ayurveda therapist level 1 course, just like 200 hour, 300 hour course. So just to have a basic introduction to Ayurveda, but to study in deeper, to go in deeper, it will take like years to go dive into Ayurveda just like Chinese medicine or just like yoga philosophy.
Also, it it takes at least three years to know the basics of Ayurveda and yoga. That's very interesting. So how are we going to do that in one podcast? I will. I will. Maybe it'll be more. Podcasts. Yeah, I will try to simplify this and just give you a brief introduction to Ayurveda. So we will just we get to know what Ayurveda is and later on we can go in detail and study.
Sure. Yeah. That sounds good. OK, so then you my understanding of what Ayurveda is, is ultimately it's like the knowledge of life from what the from the breakdown of the word itself. So what does that mean exactly? So Charaka says life is continuity of consciousness.
That means consciousness, which is inflow, that is life. So when consciousness goes away, like for example, I am doing yoga practice, I'm on the mat, I'm doing warrior one. But I'm thinking about, oh, maybe what we'll have I will have for breakfast, when will I have coffee?
So my awareness is gone. So in the mat when I am doing Warrior One, my awareness is my breath and how is my body the proprioceptional awareness and the how am I feeling like this? So all this is the body's response. But when the awareness is not there, then it is just like we become zombie. So my teachers say, you know, we often become zombies by unknowingly.
So we have to, you know, knock ourselves to wake up, to bring back that awareness. So Charaka says this very clearly. When awareness is flowing, there cannot be any disease. Disease cannot manifest when awareness is flowing. But when awareness gets blocked, there is a mistake of intelligence because awareness is also intelligence. There is a mistake of intelligence then there is a disease.
For example, if I see myself as anxious person, so basically I in the 1st place start thinking that I am anxious. This is a mistake of intelligence because it was not real. My body was not feeling anxious, I was not an anxious person but I started feeling I am anxious.
So it led on like next day I am feeling anxious, I am feeling anxious and then breathing rate became faster and after a few months then the body started responding to this thought oh I feel anxious then my breathing gets faster then my heart rate increases. So this anxiety is just manifested just by one wrong thought.
That's a mistake of intelligence, so. It's like a seed. Yeah. It's a seed that just continues to grow. Absolutely. So Charaka says very clearly that when there is a mistake of intelligence, that is the root cause of most of the disease, the psychosomatic disease.
And there is another part, acute disease that the modern science deals very well. But Charaka is actually talking about the chronic disease and also the most of the mental health disorders. So the next question that we need to ask ourself is what is this life?
What is the means of life? So Ayurveda says basically there is 4 means of life Dharma, artha, Kama and moksha. These are the four means of life. So following Dharma, Dharma means righteousness. What is right Which creates balance between oneself, one inner self and outer self, outer environment and artha means possession of material things and karma, fulfillment of the desires and moksha means liberation.
So every individual have to understand you know what part of Dharma that I am missing in where I am caught into. So balance of this 4 means of life leads us into a happy healthy life or else something is missing. Then there is in life, there is some you know, some blocks are missing. Like an imbalance.
Imbalance, yeah. OK, so Dharma that that's different from what I understood Dharma to be maybe in the yoga texts of like some, some people call it purpose, but like a like a, a deeper knowing of what you're you're to be of service for. Is that?
That's not the same thing, is it? Yeah, yes, actually it is same thing. If you see the Dharma, basically Dharma can be values. So what are the Dharma? According to yoga it is Yamaniyamas. For us yoga practitioner we have to follow the Yamaniyamas. But they also mentioned Dhrutikshama Dhamosteyam, Shauchamindriya Nigraha dhi vidya, dhi vidya 1. I have forgotten the desh lokas satyam akrodo dashakam Dharma, lakshmam.
Yeah, these 10 quality of Dharma that they mention. And also in yoga we have yama and niyamas. So basically this is just values and one who follows the the value based life, he's following the Dharma. And if we are following adharma which is opposite of Dharma like violence and speaking always lies and having possessions more and more mine, mine my and then I, I, I.
So this kind of adharma behavior. It can never lead one into a healthy or happy life. You're saying a Dharma. A Dharma, Yeah. Just cuz it sounds very similar. So basically a Dharma that's out of balance. Yes, Dharma is balance.
Balance with one inner self and outer self both have to be. Balanced and a Dharma is out of balance. A Dharma is imbalance. Imbalance like you know very interestingly, if you see the read the Bhagavad Gita, it Krishna in Bhagavad Gita goes to Duryodhana.
Duryodhana is a evil person, a bad person and Krishna himself being a God requests Duryodhana. Hey, stop this war. You know, you know, this is you are not doing right. But Duryodhana's response is like, you know, like, like a lesson for everyone. Because he says Jana pidharam nachame pravriti. He says I know what is right, but I don't want to do it. And I know what is wrong.
I want to do the wrong thing. So if oneself chooses the adharma, then it is their choice. They cannot live healthy and happy life. They have to go through their their karmas. So that's why Ayurveda gives like first preference to Dharma.
One have to follow his Dharma. A student's Dharma is to study and understand and practice, and like this they mention these qualities to be practiced so we can embody the health. But with adharma, it's impossible to embody the health.
It is just a game of egos. Game of egos, yeah? Outside they might feel like, oh, they're very healthy or nice biceps and all of that. But inside there is no peace. There is all this negative emotions are dancing like anger, jealousy, hatred, infatuation, arrogance.
All of this is dancing inside outside of very healthy fit man. But this is just the game of eco. Both have to be healthier. The in and the out. In and out, that is, by Dharma. That is Dharma. OK. And then ARTA is the possession of materials? Yes, yeah.
Like, see this material possession is really important. We it's often especially in India is ignored. But I think it's really important. It gives us a comfort. If I have to walk 10 kilometer, it takes a lot of time and lot of effort.
If I have a motorcycle, it's really good. And if I have a Mercedes car, even more better. So it's it's artha actually means the material possessions. So Ayurveda never says that you stop here like don't make money more than this. It's just the mindset of people.
It openly says possess whatever you want to possess materially. Material possession is very important. So also understanding the needs and also the wants and balancing in between them, not to go too much with the senses and having that sense of balance with the material life.
Artha. So an out of balance sense of artha could be related to like greed or using possessions to fulfill certain desires or lack of feeling, let's just say, or feeding some sort of, I don't know, dopamine response of just like purchasing and avoiding something that needs to be looked at, whether it be inward or something like that.
So there is a So what I'm hearing you say is there's a balance of possessions because, you know, there's it's like, oh, you know, possessions and minimalism and like, shouldn't you know, less is more and less is more and like, OK, there's some truth to that, But that might be more of people needing to swing the other way to find more balance in their possessions. But I agree with you.
I mean, possessions are great, right? They, they do help provide comforts and they help to make life easier. And like, you know, we badmouth cell phones and technology and all this stuff because, you know, there's a lot of unfortunate negative things that come out of it, but there's also a lot of positives that come out of it. So a balance of that would be recognizing the challenges or the difficulties and learning how to manage those very well and also benefiting from the
positives at the same time. Absolutely. Having a foundation of Dharma. So if I have a strong foundation of Dharma, then I can possess whatever I want to possess because I am walking in the righteous path. If I am walking in the righteous path, I can have any material things. It doesn't bother me, but if the base foundation is not right and then only focus is to make money and process material things, that's when the problem starts.
Is this almost like a pyramid? Would you describe it? Yes, yes. So the bottom of the pyramid being the Dharma. Dharma and that is that had to be very strongly established values. OK, now that's helpful for a visual. Yes. OK, cool, cool, Arta.
And then is there anything else there or would we, should we move on to karma? Karma. Karma. Oh, OK, so it's karma, not karma, Yeah. So karma actually often misunderstood. People think it's like a desire, so this, this and that desires, it's actually the fulfillment of the desire. So if I have a desire to have a coffee and what actually happens is when I'm drinking coffee, I'm not with the coffee, my mind is somewhere else.
Or people are working and then drinking coffee and then they want to drink more, more, more because they are not with the coffee, they are with the work. So fulfillment of the desire is you sit with the coffee, taste coffee, smell coffee and then you be with the coffee so much that you have to feel fulfilled.
So then again, the desire of having coffee should not come back to you, so it should be fulfilled. How do I fulfill desire? It's according to an individual what desire he has. How do I without missing my foundation, without missing my Dharma, how can I fulfill my desire? That's what is the fulfillment of desire. Karma is.
I like this. It makes me think of, yeah, I mean, a lot of people are doing two things at once instead of bringing in that level of presence and consciousness and whatever it is that they're doing, eating or, you know, if you are working, focusing on the work.
If you are watching a show, focusing on the show to actually fully get or experience that thing, right? Instead of half experiencing it and not actually fulfilling or scratching that itch, which would be another way of describing it, right. So if like you're, I think of this like eating sweets or eating like foods and things like this, it's like, you know, you can eat ice cream and be working at the same time or eating ice cream and watching a show or something like this. And what I'm hearing you say is
it's actually more beneficial because, you know, some people might say ice cream. Oh, not too much of that is no good, of course, with balance. But if you're eating the ice cream consciously and you're actually enjoying it and, you know, present with it breathing as you're eating it, you will actually feel more fulfilled and you're less likely to want more either immediately after or maybe later on because you'll actually get the fulfillment from that experience.
Yes, yes, absolutely. This is the fulfillment of desires. And of course we all need to meditate on fulfillment of desires because we think sometime this is the desire. The desires are not true. These days Instagram is promoting more desires, you know this new technology, new mobile phone and a new way of doing yoga. So so many way of promoting is happening through mobile phones. So we have to really understand do I really want this or this is just like from where do I
getting this inputs? So the inputs are coming from outside, then it is, it's not your karma, so input, it's coming from you. You really want to hike this mountain and then it is your desire. So then you will fulfill it. You have that contentment.
It's not because some Instagram stories that hiking Mount Agung is so good. Right. The actual, it's almost like an intuitive desire or inner like I feel like I want to do this. Or I feel like I versus like I saw someone do this and like, I feel like I should do this, but not because I actually want to do it, but because people might respect me more or people might think I'm cool if I do it.
Or it's like ticking the box and I can talk about how I did it. That would all be more of an external desire I guess versus like I want to do this for me. From inside organic desires. I'd say that that's almost difficult sometimes to separate the two, like to even know. Yes.
But I suppose, like you said before, if the foundation, the Dharma, is there, it's going to probably make it much easier. Interesting. Dharma actually sets boundaries. Dharma makes us understand yes, this is not right. This is not my path and I have to say no.
So Dharma actually saves us from so many things, so many, you know, bad habits or the connection with bad people or falling. I'll that is that is also saved by Dharma. So Dharma saves us all the time. That's why they say Dharma Rakshati Rakshataha means if you hold Dharma very strongly, Dharma will save you all the time, even during the time of death.
So that's why in Ayurveda and Yoga we give most priority to Yaman Yamas these qualities. Qualities. Yeah, OK, cool. And we're not going to get into the Yamas and the Nyamas, but I think most people understand what those are. But basically it's the philosophy of yoga or the the awareness or the consciousness of what would you call it, observations of, of those things around us and then also of us inside and kind of just noticing when things are kind of, you know, to allow us to make a
choice, right. It's not so much like commandments or rules, it's more so like these are some some guidelines or some points of reference to start to think inwardly when we're approached with some of these Yama Niyama type of situations. Yes, yeah.
So if if you're familiar with them, great. We're you know, we're not going to talk about this too much in this episode, but we do have lots of episodes where we talk about the Yamas and the Niyamas, so we can maybe link those as well. OK, cool.
Anything else with that before we move on to? Moksha. Moksha, Yeah. So in in Nobud we have a restaurant called Moksha. So good, I haven't eaten there in a while actually. Yes. So it's a liberation. You know, for some people, food is also moksha, liberation for them. And moksha actually means this complete liberation. I don't feel attached to anything. It's actually actually maybe for some people after food, they are completely liberated.
Some for some others it's Vipassana. For maybe children's, it's playing games. And like this, there should be some activity in our life that helps us to liberate, like feel completely expanded. So Swami Vivekananda says expansion is life and contraction is death. So more and more we contract, then there cannot be a moksha. So more and more we expand and accept openness that will liberate us.
So we don't know how the liberation can happen. For one of the poet in India, for Kabir, he took liberation by making, you know, clothes, the making. How do you weave into some kind of nice stitches and make a nice clothes? Like knitting kind of thing.
Yeah, knitting yeah so so like this for Buddha under a Bodhi tree and who knows first for a musician playing a music for a Yogi practicing yoga. So we have to find out that what activity can make me liberated or maybe it is ultimate liberation is actually doing nothing.
But that is in the in the later stage of life, in the beginning of life, we have to try out and find that that inner peace that is what is moksha is. So that makes me think of like meditative state kind of thing. I don't know if that kind of crosses over, you know, obviously yoga or the desires to eventually get to or not the desire, but the goal ultimately would be getting to more meditation.
Like the yoga asanas is meant to lead us more towards the meditation for their physical body to be able to sit in this state of contemplation to ultimately explore states of bliss, samadhi and so on. Whereas mock shot, you know, I think of some people who say things like, oh, you know, like running is my meditation or playing music is my meditation or singing or something like this, right?
So that's kind of what I'm hearing you say with regards to mock. So it's like a liberation of what is it being liberated from? Like the stresses of life or just the stresses of the mind maybe? Does liberation from whatever we are.
From whatever we are. Yeah, like Dharma have to vanish, dham artha have to vanish and then Kama have to vanish and then you have to become completely liberated means completely empty. That's what is liberation means. So there should not be any thought like I want to do this or any question like what is this?
So when all thoughts vanishes, then there is liberation. So Ramana Maharshi says very beautifully when when Manolaya means mind is actually liberated, mind becomes no mind, then there is liberation. Simply, if you can sit and you have no mind then you are liberated person.
Interesting. Makes me think of the feeling that I have when I like when I'm trekking or hiking and I get to like the top of, you know, there's that first moment of just like, ah, where you're not really thinking about anything.
You're just like in pure appreciation and state of presence. And just like looking at the clouds or the, the earth or whatever vantage point you have in that feeling, that sensation, which a lot of people I'm sure can relate with and how you can say blissful or liberating or expansive. It feels to kind of be in that state, yeah, at least for me. Yes, absolutely.
That's why for every single one, the liberation is very different. Painter. It's painting for me, it's doing some yoga for you, hiking. So very individually, one had to inquire, one had to find out where do I find that moksha? And of course ultimate moksha is is granted, you know, in meditation and that ultimate moksha is a long term goal. It's everyday's practice.
But how do I take a small moksha, a little little moksha from my work, work stress or from my family stress or from or from new stress These days news are the big stress. So how do I take the stress from a stress away from all of these things, set a nice relaxation into myself and then I will think about ultimate moksha. So these are the four means of life which have to be completely like questioned and completely focused by individual. Then they can, you know, can
lead their life into positive life, positive health. And it all starts with the Dharma, the foundation, the philosophies, the lifestyle and these things. And then that allows us to have healthy possession of materials or material possession, to appreciate the physical world in the way that it needs to be respected as well.
And then fulfilling the use of some of these materials or the fulfilling the desires or the experiences of this physical world in a healthy way. I'm just trying to like break it down for my brain a little bit. Yes. Ultimately allowing us to get to a state of liberation so that we can appreciate what all this is without actually trying to make sense of it or think it through or try to like understand it, but just be with it. Absolutely.
Not to oversimplify it, but that's what I'm. That's what I'm hearing, yeah. And now this leads us into the next topic of Ayurveda that is health. And like you know The Who definition of Ayurveda, the health is health is not merely absence of disease but physical, mental, spiritual, social Wellness.
OK, thank you so much for tuning into this week's episode. We're going to put it on pause and we're going to continue this conversation next week where we have Akshay returning to continue talking about Ayurvedic medicine and diving more into Ayurvedic health. So thank you so much for listening this week. If.
You'd like to. Continue some conversation with Akshay. You can come back to episodes one 38139 and 1:40 where we have Akshay coming in telling us about his story, his biography and his life of growing up with yoga and how mantras were such a deep.
Part of that experience. And then episodes 1:39 and 1:40 where? Akshay shares with us. His knowledge. Of yoga philosophy. Diving into the Yoga Sutras, Patanjali's Yoga Sutras, cultivating more health and happiness in your life.
Otherwise, thank you so much and we will see you next week to continue the conversation with Ayurveda. Bye for now. All right, before you go, let me just tell you about the going proyoga.com platform. So right now you can go to goingproyoga.com and check it out for. Free for seven days where you can actually learn. More about yoga in the ways of alignment, queuing, sequencing, yoga.
Anatomy so that if you've done a 2. 100 hour teacher training. And you want to. Continue to learn, practice and grow. This platform is definitely for you, so I definitely suggest checking it out. Going proyoga.com right now? You can try it out.
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