Balancing Boundaries: Navigating Mental Health in Yoga Teacher Training with Dr. Brendan

0:00 Hey there, before we get started on this week's episode, I would love to ask for your support by reviewing this podcast. We want to share yoga with as many people as possible and this free resource, this podcast is one of the ways that we can do that. And the best way that you can help support us is by giving us a review.

0:16 So if you go to Apple Podcasts or Spotify or whatever podcast platform you use, Scroll down until you find that star review and then give us some love. Thank you so much, and let's get started with this week's episode. We tend to attract more males in our trainings than the average yoga teacher training. I would say the average yoga teacher training that I work in is like 30 women and like maybe two men, maybe one man, right? Which is fine.

0:43 And we tend to get maybe five to let's say 8:00 or so out of a flock of 30. And then I get excited when there's younger or older and just like a nice mix, right 'cause then it's like, this is, this is what the world is, right? The world isn't just a bunch of skinny white people practicing yoga, You know what I mean?

0:59 Even though that's what the posters on Instagram looks like. It's like, no, everybody can practice yoga. Young, old, you know, big, small, weak, strong, you know, from a physical physique perspective, different religions, different backgrounds, like it doesn't matter. Flexible.

1:14 Inflexible. Exactly my hand up. Inflexible. Yeah. Exactly, and a lot of people will, but they won't even try yoga because they're like, I'm not flexible enough for that. And it's like, fair enough. They don't understand, right?

1:25 But it, I think it's important for people to know that yoga is for everybody. If they want it to be, if they want it, it is there for them. And yoga will receive you right. It will not reject you. Welcome to the Going Pro Yoga podcast. If you love yoga as much as I do, then this podcast is for you.

1:45 We talk all things yoga related for teachers in order to supplement and complement and even support after a 200 hour yoga teacher training. Or if you've never done a training before, this podcast is all about just learning more about yoga in an authentic way. Together with Paul Tioto and Byron de Marseille, we put together this podcast to provide you with a free resource to learn more about yoga.

2:07 Whether you want to share yoga or teach yoga or just practice yoga. This podcast is talking all things yoga related, and we're trying to talk from the teacher's perspective and also the student's perspective to make sure we get a full 360° angle on what yoga is all about and how it's evolved in the modern world.

2:23 Welcome to our podcast. Good afternoon from Bali. Hello and welcome back to the podcast That's including you. Brendan, how are you? Thank you, Michael. I am great. Yeah. Thanks for the welcome and lovely to be here. And also welcome 'cause we're doing this reciprocal thing, which I enjoy. Yeah.

2:45 Yeah, exactly. Thank you for leading though. Of course, of course. So in case you're tuning into this episode and you're kind of wondering, OK, what's going on here? So this is a part of a series that we've been recording over the last several weeks about connecting and deconstructing yoga's philosophies or the elements of yoga and bringing it into the mental health realm.

3:06 And kind of basically talking about similar concepts, but using different language to try to digest a little bit more of what some of the yoga philosophy is and kind of relating back to certain, let's just say, I don't want to say day-to-day, but you know, mental health issues or common conversations around mental health and well-being concerns.

3:28 And that's basically what the last three episodes have been. The first one was mostly about just kind of setting the foundation, like what is mental health and like what does it actually mean? And then the the following two episodes, which would be #2 and three really talk about yoga philosophy and kind of deconstructing what some of those philosophical practices are and kind of looking at them from a mental health lens and a well-being lens.

3:51 And Brendan's been a huge help for contributing to that as a clinical psychiatrist. So super awesome to have your expertise here. And then for today, we're going to continue a similar concept, but it's going to kind of blend into more of like a training or the the environment of Aytt of doing a 200 hour training or maybe other types of trainings and what kind of stuff happens there?

4:17 And like, what are some things to think about? Maybe it's happened to you, maybe you're thinking about doing your training and it's just kind of interesting to to unpack some of the things that we've seen and just talk about it from a professional perspective.

4:31 Yeah. Sound good? Yeah, sounds great. And talking about not in like I'm, I don't want to medicalize it. And I'll just say the quick disclaimer again, this is not medical advice. We're not giving you clinical advice. But today we are kind of going to talk a little bit about not the contraindications so much, but what things can maybe go astray in a YTT or a yoga class as well. I think Michael has more of a firm idea potentially about the exacts of what we're going to

5:06 talk about. But the reason we're talking about yoga mental health from the other side is that yoga is supposed to improve your life. And we've gone into the philosophy around that. But at the same time, yoga comes in many different forms and it's reaching a huge audience through the world. It's very mainstream nowadays.

5:26 And sometimes, you know, just like every single thing apart from like, breathing, but it's not right for everyone in the right moment. Although some teachers aren't right for some people or some movements are right for some people. So we're just talking a little bit about, you know, the things we might need to watch out.

5:44 Yeah, and be aware. Of from a mental health point of view. Yeah, fantastic. Cool. So I have a list of a few things and yeah, basically I think I'll just kind of go through one and we'll just see what comes up. All righty.

5:56 Yeah, cool. So the first one that I have listed here is just pretty straightforward stress and anxiety. OK, stress and anxiety, the intensity of a training and the volume of information to absorb. If you've done the 200 hour training, you know what that is in the profession. The sorry, the pressure to perform well in both the physical practice, possibly a self-made pressure just to make a note of that, and the theoretical understanding of what you're learning and how

6:27 much to absorb could lead to a possible stress and anxiety. Therefore, managing these expectations and these challenges while often sorry, while often maintaining other life responsibilities at the same time, can quite be overwhelming, especially if you're working or you have kids or you know what, whatever else is going on.

6:45 So that's like a very general one, but I think we should definitely at least address it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's a good one. From a personal experience and my yoga teacher training, the first one was 200 hour. It's so immersive and you don't know who's going to be in there.

7:00 And it is a little bit competitive. Like people are generally pretty good at yoga. And there's some smart cookies there. And you really. Yeah. You're like, you're there from was it like 7:30 in the morning sometimes until 6:00 at night. And you're, you don't have time to do your work. Not really can you can't really maintain a huge amount of contact with the outside world.

7:25 So you're there. And for those of us that want to do well, we put a little bit of pressure on ourselves potentially. So it's kind of the the repetitive physical stress as well as just the stress of wanting to to do well. I think I know maybe you can expand on that. Yeah.

7:40 I mean, absolutely it's, it depends on your personality as well, right. And obviously there's certain factors that might make you more of what we would call like a perfectionist or someone who really wants to show their value or show that they know or show that they are good, right?

7:57 Which I'm sure a lot of people can relate with. And that in itself in a, in a, in an educational setting or a training setting where you're learning and also kind of like not necessary performing, but you're sharing what you're learning. There's elements of evaluation or assessment that's happening and that can sometimes be, I would almost say like subconsciously triggering to be like, OK, I need to like perform in this way and be this way, which it's good to have a little bit of that pressure.

8:28 This is kind of like if, if you listen to the previous top topics, we talked about tapas, which is one of the niyamas about basically through heat or, or, or releasing stress through heat or releasing energy through challenge.

8:43 You could kind of describe it in different ways. But basically when you're put in a pressure cooker type situation and the pressure cookering is at a reasonable temperature, let's just say there's some growth that can happen, some expansion, some positiveness that can happen there.

8:58 And how to evaluate that for each individual person is very obviously situational. But that's, that's like at a positive, let's just say to kind of throw into the, the stress and a certain level of anxiety cause anxiety can also be, let's just say a, a beneficial thing at the right amount or the right quantity. So I think, yeah, it's really difficult to evaluate like how this lands for every single person in their training. So it's obviously each

9:22 individual person's experience. But I would say that what I see a lot of is a lot of perfectionists, a lot of people being like, oh, no, I need to be good at yoga or I need to be able to be good at the public speaking to be able to stand up there. And it's like if I say something wrong, you know, I'm making mistakes and there's, you know, people might judge me or I'm disappointing someone that's not maybe in this room, but you know what I mean?

9:46 Subconsciously, you know, that's kind of like playing into the to the psyche a little bit. So that can all be a little bit challenging and triggering for certain individuals. Especially like you mentioned, if some people are really good already, they're really good at public speaking, They have no problem being in front of a group of people.

10:01 Their practice is strong and they feel like they already understand yoga. Maybe they've already done a training before, maybe they've been practicing for 10 years. Be very intimidating. Very intimidating. Totally. Totally.

10:12 You reminded me of this, this phenomenon that happens a lot in yoga teacher trainings and other kind of learning environments where with perfectionists and that's when they get asked to do something, their anxiety gets in the way of them doing the actual thing, whatever comes up because they're so worried about getting it right. Then they ask the instructor like, you know, OK, so are we doing that now?

10:41 Are we? You know, they'll, they'll get instructions and then they then they just have to ask like all these questions like, oh, do we do it on these mats? You know, how do we do this? What do we do? Like all these questions that don't really need to be asked.

10:57 And if you just go with the instructions that have been given and let it flow, and even if you make you get a little bit wrong, it doesn't really matter because it gets in the way of them receiving and enjoying the thing as opposed to, but their anxiety kind of overwhelms them. And then they've got to ask 100 questions to try and make sure that it's perfect before they even start. And then I, I don't know if you've seen this thing where you're like, and then you get in

11:22 the cycle of asking questions and it takes another 20 or 30 minutes to actually get into the thing that you've been asked to do because there's people asking all these questions that don't really need to be asked. Yeah. Absolutely. And it's it's almost like repeating yourself a little bit and you're kind of like, but you also want to you want to support the questions.

11:39 Yes, right. You don't want to dismiss them, so you want to answer them, but you're also kind of like trying to draw them back to don't worry about that so much for now. Like I understand what you're saying, but like just focus on this, you know, it's trying to bring them back.

11:51 So I understand that. Yeah, it's the. Anxiety of the unknown? Exactly. And. I'm yeah, I'm not saying like, and obviously the teachers need to respond empathetically, but if you're one of those people that like ask lots and lots of questions that I used to be one of them too.

12:05 At before you even start, just remember, just try and sometimes just take a little a breath and just go. It's going to be OK. Well, whatever happens here, trust that someone's going to correct you or whatever. Yeah, yeah, just. Go with the flow, especially in like a training learning situation.

12:19 It's hard for people to remember that like we're all learning here, right? So especially if you come in with like a certain amount of and who knows, some of these people that come and join trainings, like they're like top level CE OS and they, you know, they're entrepreneurs.

12:33 So they have this like self-made pressure of like, I need to be my best at all moments. And then you come in and be a student again. It's kind of hard to just be a student again, right? You have to like almost be like, I already know this stuff or I'm already going to be good at this. Or at least that might be a story playing. So it's hard to let go of that.

12:49 Yeah, to just become in raw and just be like I'm going to take it. Yeah. So it's it's it's it's a challenge or it's a like you said, the stress of the unknown or thought those pretty good can. I just make a suggestion that we talk about. There's so much in this area to talk about. I reckon today let's, as you've done, let's just focus on yoga teacher trainings because my mind's going to yoga as well. But I think the yoga teacher training is really like, it's its own thing, isn't it?

13:17 Right. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, it's a container, Yeah. And in the container, different things yeah happen. I don't know if that needs to be included, but if it's not, there you go, folks. You've got my thought process going.

13:27 Our thought process, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, cool. Let's look at another one. This one's it's kind of related, but it's it's labeled as imposter syndrome. Oh. Nice, yeah. So many students might feel that they are not good enough quote UN quote to become yoga teachers. And this lack of self-confidence can be intensified by comparing themselves to peers or instructors, leading to feelings of inadequacy and self doubt.

13:56 Yeah, In my experience, the people that are the least good at yoga in these trainings are sometimes the most like, they provide the most value and they're the most fun to be around. And some of them also go on to be excellent, use yoga in different ways.

14:13 That is excellent. So. And I think if you don't have a bit of impostor syndrome, then maybe that's a concern in itself. Like you're not really there to learn. Yeah. But it, it's AI love how these two topics already, they just apply to any kind of environment where you're testing yourself out.

14:32 Yeah. Yeah. When the pressure's there, yeah. And it just, it always makes me think of just like school, like it's, it's going back to school kind of thing. And if as an adult, it's like now you're you're. It's almost like this might be weird and might not be accurate, but I'm going to say it anyway.

14:48 It's kind of like the feeling that some some people might have when they go back to their like high school reunion and it's like, I I need them showing up here and I need to show how cool I am now or how awesome I am and how, how much I know and, and what I, you know, maybe not from like a business perspective, but when it relates to the yoga, there might be a certain elements of that for some people.

15:05 And I don't want to say from an ego. I mean, it is an ego perspective, but not maybe not like like an I'm better than you then more so like I want to show that I'm worth something kind of thing. Which, yeah, it's it's, it's interesting to see those elements kind of come in because I mean, I can relate with that.

15:24 And, you know, being someone who's put a lot of pressure on myself to show up and want to be good at things. And even in my teacher training, which was years ago, like I remember like doing my final and teaching my, my, my piece and like, I don't even remember what I taught.

15:38 I like kind of blacked out 'cause I was so like, don't fuck up, don't fuck up, don't fuck up. Like don't make a mistake. Like, you know, the teachers watching you. I want to impress the teacher, make sure to impress the teacher.

15:47 I want them to think I'm good. And like, I'm sure a lot of people could relate with that. But it's like now I realize like that doesn't matter. That doesn't matter. And you know, it was all about just learning. Just do it, go for it. You're supported, have fun with it, make mistakes, right? That's awesome.

16:03 And assuming the container, of course, is supportive and feeling safe enough to make mistakes, that can help to nurture that. And you know, I don't, can't speak for all the teacher trainings, but I definitely work with some teacher trainings where that container's not as held, let's say. Yeah, yeah, I think.

16:23 It's good on that note to when you're thinking of a teacher training to ask the teachers who it's appropriate for and whether that's going to meet at your level, and then probably ask a few people that have been there. Don't just take the teacher's advice because it is a business at the end of the day.

16:40 Yeah. That's a good point, actually. Yeah, I mean, definitely if, if you haven't taken the training or you're thinking of taking an advanced training or more training, like I'm sure some of you probably already know this, but like, yeah, like get to know the teacher, make sure you're you like the teacher, make sure you resonate with their teaching style and also just their personality and the way that they are 'cause you're gonna be around that for a lot of time in

17:02 the training. So and then, yeah, getting the perspective of the people that have already done it is always helpful as well. Multiple perspectives. So cool, let's go through. OK, so the next one I have, this one's a little bit kind of obvious as well, but like physical and emotional exhaustion, which again comes back to the tapas thing of like putting yourself through a certain amount of let's just say healthy stress.

17:25 But the demanding schedule and physical intensity of a yoga teacher training can lead to exhaustion usually around week two, day eight or nine is what I've seen. So this physical strain coupled with emotional journey of self discovery possibly and reflection that yoga often prompts can result in significant fatigue, right?

17:48 It's not just from a physical perspective of actually moving your body and releasing, you know, let's say toxins in the body that need to be processed and detoxified, but then also just emotionally like learning new things and challenging your own thoughts and things that you've believed and then starting to like in just process information that all requires so much energy. And yeah, there's not a lot of break time, right? So it's really important to take

18:13 care of yourself in those moments because of the physical and emotional exhaustion. Yeah, yeah. And how that can impact your overall well-being and mental health. Of course, irritability, sensitivity, these. Sorts of things it's a big old journey I remember I don't know, I think this is a me issue, but I hear it's common Yoga toe the skin was peeling off my big toes because when doing like power yoga, sweating a lot and then I just never repeated like. Rubbing, yeah.

18:46 Like and doing endless, endless cycles of kind of thing. The word for it, but you know this rolling. Over your toes, Yeah. Yeah, in some salutations, yeah, it would. Just like it would just tosses. Exactly. Yeah. It took a took a a toll on the body.

19:01 And then you get people that want to like, it's very social events, you know, seeing people all the time going out to dinner. And eventually it's like, Oh my God, I just need to go home and chill out and sleep or get a massage or something because it's a big toll, Yeah.

19:17 Yeah. And you know, for a lot of people who do the trainings, they're often travelling. And if they're in Bali, at least here, this is what we see is a lot of people are travelling and they're excited to meet new people and do new things and see new things and eat at new restaurants and explore the area.

19:32 And the little time that you have outside of the training is that's the time you have to do that, which also has an impact of energy consumption that can lead to more of that have. You seen people drop out of trainings because of that.

19:49 Good question. No, I don't think I've seen that once in, I want to say about 50 trainings, give or take. The only time I've seen someone drop out is whenever they weren't sure, they didn't realize what they signed up for.

20:04 They thought a yoga teacher training was a a yoga retreat. Meaning they were going to come and do yoga and just like eat food and just relax and then travel and enjoy. And I've had, I want to say only two people that I've seen in the trainings that I've been like facilitating or, or lead in to actually know the students all very well individually versus being a teacher that just comes in and teaches a particular lecture on anatomy or something like that, which is fair.

20:32 I mean, you would expect that at least at some point where there's just a misunderstanding and then, you know, we, I forget what we do, but it's usually like a refund or a transferable thing just to kind of support that person's misunderstanding.

20:45 But most people, they truck through, right? Probably because a lot of us have been trained to do that in school, right? Just push through and go for it. Even if you are exhausted and show up, even though you're tired. And, you know, sometimes people are like sleeping in lectures and they're just like holding on to the energy that they have. And I just, you know, I don't judge them for it. I just say, hey, I tried to tell them early on, like this is going to happen.

21:07 You're going to get tired eventually. And you know that your body position is going to either support that or it's going to move you more into wanting to go to sleep. If you want to go to sleep, like that's cool. You know, I'm not going to judge you on it. But if you do want to stay awake, like get up, move around a little bit, like respectfully, of course, to allow yourself to stay engaged.

21:29 And then I also encourage people to like when you go home, like rest, you know, be by yourself for a little bit. Like try not to do every social thing when you haven't have a day off. Don't drive across the island and go to the beach and like be in the sun all day and then come back the next day and then you're back in school, as much fun as that is. And I understand all that, but like that's going to affect the rest of your week or the future days. So do other people listen,

21:52 listen to me or not is another thing. But if you haven't taken a training or you've taken a training and you haven't practiced it in that way, it can really help to enhance your experience, not just from like the learning, but the physical, the physicality of what you're learning. You can have more energy, more presence for that type of stuff, I would say.

22:13 Any thoughts on that physical and emotional exhaustion? No, I think it's like what I thought was I wonder if some people are now listening going, do I want to do a yoga teacher training? And if it's not just for, you know, if it's not a retreat and it's, it's not a retreat, but it has elements of a retreat like a, a self development type situation. And a lot of people don't do it just to be yoga teachers. In fact, probably at least 1/4 of the people when I did it were there to improve.

22:46 I think to improve your yoga is a pretty standard thing. And yeah, potentially to meet a whole bunch of interesting people from around the world is another reason. And probably most people that were in the trainings that I've done, I know maybe 50% at least have not gone on to teach.

23:05 So it's not like a, a chilled retreat, but it's also you do it for reasons other than, you know, being a yoga teacher. Yeah, I I don't teach yoga at the moment, right. Yeah, yeah, it's a good point. I mean, thinking about this podcast, it's like, oh, we're talking about a lot of negatives or not negatives, but just like some of the downfalls to some of these emotional or mental challenges.

23:30 But yeah, I mean, good on you for like bringing up some positive to it. It's like the yoga teacher training is, can be very transformational for individuals because of some of these challenges and, and moving past them and being supported through them, through your peers and the teachers hopefully and, and yourself.

23:46 So it's, I mean, there's a reason why every month here in Bali, thousands and thousands of new yoga teachers graduate. It's. Crazy, it's. Insane how many teacher trainings exist every single month on this island in the, in this world of my, like, my vision, like what I see in my world, I could like, count probably 2 to 300 students a month just from what I know on this island. And that's a small, small sample of what it actually is. So like, I don't even know,

24:15 maybe 10,000 like every month. It's like insane. Yeah. That's why it just we're just in one, in one city that you would see most of those. Yeah. Which I don't know this, this might be a tangent, but why is it that people do yoga teacher trainings? Like, what is it that people looking for? What do you think?

24:38 I think that there's a couple of reasons. I would say one is that someone's experienced yoga in whatever shape or form, could be long period of time. It could have been a short period of time, but the yoga did something for them. It did something in a way that was impactful for them. Help them do it through a difficult time. Help them to to let's heal or recover from something, possibly physically.

25:06 It gave them something to focus on during a challenging time. It helped them to kind of get clarity through certain challenges, but basically it served them and serve them. And then it's almost like I see a lot of people just being like, I want to know, I want to learn more about yoga.

25:23 And what better way to do that than the only way to do that really is to do yoga teacher training, right? So This is why a lot of people who do to yoga teacher trainings are not, they're not necessarily saying I want to be a teacher when they show up. They're just like, I just want to learn more about yoga. That's why that's why most of them do it. It's because I just want to learn more about yoga, which is great.

25:42 Yeah, I, I I completely agree with that. This yoga has I like that idea of yoga has served them in some way like it's given them some peace. It's given them a really nice way to exercise. It's been a way to to feel good and it's probably allowed them to function in a dysfunctional society in some ways.

26:03 And then they want to scratch that itch and it'll, I mean, also it's just like, cool, you come to Bali or you go to India or whatever, do your yoga teacher training. But you use that word earlier transformational. And I think a lot of people do it with the the expectation of some sort of personal development or some sort of transformation. And honestly, the best ones do give you that as well. Yeah, they're well.

26:29 Give you that opportunity exactly. Yeah, I would say transformational experience. What does that even mean, right. Does that mean like 10 out of 10, nine out of 10? Like what does it even mean? It's a very subjective way of describing change basically.

26:44 So for some people, a small step in, in a, in a direction could be transformational for them, right? And then a large step could also be transformational, like so evaluating that is, I would say, very difficult, but I would say the challenge of a yoga teacher training, the intensity that we talked about, the physical stress, the emotional stress, the learning that you do just, and, and also just the lessons of what yoga is, the lifestyle and all these things, the

27:07 philosophies, all of that stuff. Just it challenges possibly some things that you've learned or believed or known or habits. And that in itself can be something that is transformational, even if it's just a small thing, right?

27:26 So that's why I think for a lot of people, they, they feel like there was something that happened for them there, right? And it could involve actually like meeting new people and resonating with different people in the world.

27:36 And, and then being like, wow, this person from Germany and, and this person from Ireland, like they're so similar to me and I get along so well with them and we have similar, you know, experiences. So there's the element of especially, particularly with like travelling trainings that can go into different parts of the world.

27:50 You get to see different people. And then you have the element of the travel benefits that I would say because like travelling, if you travel, you understand that there's a certain benefit from traveling, which is seeing the world for different lens and learning about different cultures.

28:04 And and that allows you to kind of find your place a little bit more, at least validate a little bit of what your place is, which I think creates a bit of a platform for possible change, for possible transformation. Yeah, absolutely.

28:19 And this is where I'm going to bring in the risks because people are looking for a transformational experience or some sort of positive experience. And they might come from a position, I use the word might, of feeling a bit lost or feeling a bit unhappy.

28:34 They come to a place where it's not necessarily regulated and you don't necessarily know what the qualifications of the teachers are. You don't know if they can support that. And the marketing might be such that you feel like it's going to be an amazing experience.

28:54 And but sometimes that's not the case. And there are things that are going to really challenge you. Like we've already talked about stress, the physical challenge, the people around you might be challenging because you might not get on with them. And then the teachers as well, like if you don't match with them or they're a bit unsafe, then that might also be a risk to your health.

29:19 And just bringing in some statistics that at least in the Western world, 20% of people or one in five have a mental health condition, 50% of people are going to go through some sort of mental health condition in their life.

29:33 So statistically speaking, if you got a class of 30 people, one in five of those, so six people are going to have mental health conditions. Not that that that does not at all mean that they can't participate. And then you might not even know they've got kind of a condition and they might, this might be great for their condition, but it does mean that you potentially might have people that are vulnerable and people are going to be vulnerable in other ways as well. And if you haven't, if you don't

30:01 really know what's going to happen during that training or who the people and who don't get on with them, there is a risk that it might make you more unwell because it's a stressful environment. If you have something like bipolar disorder and you that's triggered by sleep deprivation, then yoga teacher trainings can be like really long.

30:25 So you're working all day. And it can also be energizing because you are working with different energies that, you know, you kind of expand. It's this is a bit woo woo, but you'd go into things like something like Kundalini yoga and you all of a sudden feel like you have a bit of energy that you've never had. And you're not necessarily ready for that expansion of yoga. And so you're up all night and you're doing it again and again and again for two or three

30:50 weeks. Then you might end up in Bali or India or somewhere and finding that you're relapsing into your bipolar disorder or some mania. And that can be, that can be a, that can be a danger. So I think I just mentioned this because we're talking about the risks.

31:11 Another thing that can happen is, I think, and this is a common experience, isn't this not just talking from my point of view, but if you have teachers that want you to feel good and you're doing lots of yoga that you can, you're doing lots of meditation and you're kind of you're expansive.

31:30 Like you're opening up, you're, you're reaching parts of your, your psyche that you might not have felt before. And this is a wonderful experience for people. And I know in some of the like polls and Byron's trainings that they have these, you know, people are often sharing, you know, really vulnerable stuff, which is wonderful.

31:48 And it's like some of the most transformational stuff for people. But that also can be really triggering and, or can destabilize people 'cause it's stressful and it's opening. And you've got this way of being that you're not familiar with, like you're feeling, you know, for people that feel like they feel more at one with the world, they feel more connected, it can be very overwhelming.

32:14 And that can trigger things like psychosis and mania again. So yeah. And I've, you know, I've witnessed it in the training that some people had opening experiences and then they want to come off medication or they want to, you know, try something because all of a sudden everything feels a lot better. You know, they, they don't need therapy anymore or something like that.

32:40 I just say this to probably avoid making any big changes during the yoga teacher training, but finish that stay, you know, stay in touch with your mental health professionals and then discuss it afterwards. Like if that feeling of expansiveness and new new unis continues, then that's like a week or a month or five months down the track.

33:03 That's when you'd probably talk about making some changes to your lifestyle. That's just a perspective that I, I've, you know, I've personally experienced with some people. Yeah, yeah. That's good advice. I would say there's a certain high feeling that happens for people after training, which is a lot of the benefit, right, called the transformation, the connection with people, the friendships, the learning, the the new perspective on life and lifestyle, learning about

33:32 philosophy, seeing the different possibilities and just. A removal from your difficult everyday world for three weeks. Exactly. Yeah, it's like blissful for for some. So you have this high and that's what happens if it's like high like that people have after the training or towards the end of the training.

33:52 And that lingers for quite a while. I would say, you know, it fades a bit over time. So I also would say to some degree, to some degree that it's important to allow some integration in time to process what just happened, 3 weeks of BAM, right?

34:09 Allow that to process a little bit, allow you to integrate that into what your life actually is because your life wasn't that those three weeks. And that's not a realistic microcosm or flash of your life, the three weeks, because it's just a small thing how that impacts your life, hopefully positively is, is fantastic. But it takes time for that change, that integration to happen.

34:31 And I think giving some time before making any huge decisions would be smart, right? Because you're on this high or it's almost like you're, you're on this drug or this state of mind, which might be fantastic. And maybe there is going to be good decisions that come from this place, but those decisions can also be made later as well. Just give it some time to just see. Let things process like ride the wave of the emotion, ride the wave of the information, ride

34:56 the wave of what it's like to be here, then to not be here. And then go back to work and be with family, be with friends. And then just start to notice how that stuff that you learn, the teachings, the experience integrates or is resisted or is attracted to the things that you were doing in your life.

35:14 And then from that place you can make, I would say, wise decisions. Wise decisions, yeah. Yeah, it's that balance of using that new knowledge but not doing anything too crazy that's going to impact the rest of your life.

35:32 Like if the getting away from your everyday life has been the thing that's made you feel good, then by all means go back and try and change a little bit of your everyday life. But also everyday life is everyday life. And there's some of those realities that you'll need to just live with, I guess. And creating too much change is going to cause, you know, potentially issues to family members or jobs or whatever. So yeah, sit that advice of sitting with the that that high and allowing that to be and then

36:06 trying to integrate that by talking to people about it while making some cautious changes in most circumstances is probably the best way to go about it. Yeah, that's great. Yeah. I don't want to uproot too much, even though I do see some people uproot a lot and they make.

36:22 The Bali move they make. A Bali, yeah, they move to Bali or they're, or they say, I just got so much clarity on this that I'm, I've, you know, I've been thinking about this for a while and then this training or this. There was a moment here that helped me make that decision. Yes.

36:35 So it's like, OK, great. You know, like that's awesome. So I don't want to take anything away from, you know, making big changes or moves after something like this. I think what we're saying is just there's more of a draw to want to move into change or like flip some of your world upside down possibly. And if you are, if you do want to do that, just give it some time and allow it to process a little bit, especially if it's a new idea, because all those

37:02 things usually require some time to fully, fully look at it before actually jumping into it. So yeah, that's what I'd say. Yeah. Cool. All right. So we kind of touched on a few other things, but that I have listed here, so I'm just going to read about. But identity and values conflicts. So you kind of mentioned like not jiving necessarily with other people, but possibly the content, maybe the yoga philosophy or something to this effect, right. So as students, when we dive

37:30 deeper into yoga philosophy and ethics, they might encounter, excuse me, conflicts between what they are learning and their pre-existing beliefs or values. So this can lead to sometimes confusion and identity questioning.

37:45 Right. Do you think that yoga is its own religion? Do I think that? Yeah, I would say no, no, OK. I. Can see how a lot of people would say yes, yeah 'cause it's like, oh, it's a lifestyle people will probably come with. Oh no, yoga's more of a lifestyle.

38:11 So this is my own personal opinion. So it's on a podcast. A lot of people are listening to it, but yeah, I, I would say no. To me, it doesn't feel like a religion. If it satisfies and pleases someone for them to say like, oh, it is a religion, then I'm like, OK, that's great. I'm glad that you see it that way. I don't see it that way, but I totally respect that you do kind of thing because there's certain elements of yoga because yoga's been around for a long time and

38:33 there's certain things like even like the Ashtanga practice, I don't really resonate with that too much, right? So is it in my pickpocketing the parts of this quote UN quote religion or the things that I'm learning from it to be like, yes, I do follow this and I don't follow these other things or I don't necessarily resonate or believe in those other things. And I mean, I was raised Catholic, which is probably not probably the right example actually, because at least in my household and the way that I was

39:01 raised, it was very dogmatic. Like this is the only way and this is the only belief. And you know, there's a lot of like shame if you don't follow certain rules and stuff like that of what the religion thing. So I have this like perspective of what religion is, which is this rigidity and not freedom of exploration and freedom of, you know, seeing what feels right for you. And I believe that religion, all religions, including yoga, are just practices to help us find

39:35 ourselves more, find out who we are, find out what we are, find out what everything is around us, what is life, what is God, all these things, types of things and from different cultures, perspectives and what traditionally might have been passed on from families and ancestors and stuff like that.

39:52 That's where kind of these like religions or these groups are formed. And it's all great. You know, it's all senses of community that's created and, you know, certain moral guidelines to follow. So I think it's fantastic. And I think yoga has elements of that, But from learning yoga and being around so many yogis, especially yogis like Vijeth and Akshay, some of the philosophy teachers that we associate with who've just been studying yoga since they were like kids, and they're just so accepting of

40:20 everything. Whereas I would say a lot of religions aren't necessarily super accepting of other religions. So to me, it doesn't really feel the same. That's what I would say, yeah. I like that perspective. It, I think it feels like cultish to some people perhaps. And there is that, that tension that if you come into an environment where people are sometimes chanting, they're holding poses, they sometimes have little, you know, Eastern religious figures around the the

40:53 place and certain studios. It's tempting to go down to feel like that, but it's fine. You know, people can feel how they want. So I don't know, I maybe I'm just missing this one, but I feel like any good, like yoga is more like a tasting plate of how you can make your life better in various ways. And as you said, come to your true self. And if that's going to bring you towards a God of some sort or take you to some sort of other philosophy or scientific belief or just knowing yourself better,

41:29 that's the purpose. Like that's great. And it's doing it through a, a combination of mind and and body. So well, I guess the warning is if someone's taken yoga too seriously and your yoga teacher training would be a bit sceptical, right?

41:42 Like it's not if they're trying to change your beliefs about something, then that's not, that's not good. But yeah, maybe that's it's talking about also uncomfortable feelings that can come up and that's legit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm always sceptical of anything that's dogmatic or two rigid. Like there's, I feel like there's room for for everything to some degree, right?

42:05 Whether you agree with it or not is somewhat relevant, but also kind of irrelevant. It's more so just like there's room for it, right? There's an abundance. OK, so the other one I have here is and I can, I can, I can see this just reflecting back on some trainings, but isolations and loneliness. So while yoga teacher trainings can be community building experiences, the introspective nature of the practice might also lead to some individuals feeling isolated and lonely, particularly if they're

42:36 perceiving that their personal experiences or struggles are not being shared by other people's experiences. Because maybe certain shares are happening and they didn't share what they're experiencing. And they just feel like I don't resonate with a lot of the people in this room.

42:50 So they they might feel that they need to withdraw or they don't feel like they need, they don't feel confident to speak up and it almost like creates a bit of a separation. I can see that and have seen certain elements of that to some degree. So it's a risk, I would say, yeah. Is it riskier you'd say, in bigger trainings? Yeah, bigger.

43:10 Groups, which, yeah, the crowd effect, I don't know if you're familiar with the crowd effect, but the crowd effect is like the larger the group, it's easier for the people to hide or not take action into something. So it's like, imagine this, if you are, you know, let's say there's a, a, a house burning down or a, or a, a Hut or something that you see is starting to burn and there's hundreds of people surrounding and there's like a few people that are like helping and stuff

43:41 like that. And you're one of those hundreds of people or, you know, you might not feel like, oh, I, I don't really need to do anything because there's already people here. So I'm just going to like watch from the distance in the back, kind of observe or maybe I'm just going to leave, right? Versus if your house is burning down or there's a Hut that's happening and you're, you're one of like 5 people or three people or two people, you're going to be like, oh shit, I got to do something to help them, right?

44:05 So you can't hide from the crowd effect, right? So on the larger yoga teacher trainings, 30 plus people, I would say maybe even 25 plus people, the crowd effect kicks in where it's harder for you to, sorry, it's easier for you to kind of hide, right? But if you have a training of like 10/15/20 people, like you can't really hide.

44:25 Like you're, you're going to be counted, your head is going to be counted pretty easily. But what I would say that can happen even in some of our trainings with like 30 or so people, sometimes some people can be, I don't want to say forgotten, but if they're hiding, it's hard to kind of notice sometimes if they're not. So it's really important for us as teachers is what we do is to really make sure that we to do a scan, you know, every every day, every two days.

44:51 Like who are we missing? Anyone? Is there anyone that we're noticing that needs extra help, extra attention? Right. And that's really important from the nurturing and caring perspective, from training. But I can see how some people, especially if language is an issue as well, then they might not resonate and connect 'cause they, it's very difficult for them. That can create certain elements of loneliness and isolation as well.

45:12 Yeah. Yeah, particularly people from maybe non white backgrounds. I'm gonna say like, I know there's actually very few, not so many males that are in teacher training. So males could feel isolated, non white, like different age groups, like the age typical age seems to be, I know like 20 to maybe mid 30s.

45:37 So people that are really young or a bit older might feel a bit isolated. Yeah, I agree. I'm in the training right now with a 16 year old and I can feel her tibidness and wondering like, do I belong here? You know, and she's in the training with people who are like 40 and 2025 and 30 and 35. And so definitely, yeah, like a certain younger element feels like, do I, am I supposed to be here? And then somewhat older as well.

46:02 If you have someone sometimes will have like a 6065 year old or 5055 year old and they'll also have a little bit of that, but they have a certain amount of I'd say maturity overall that allows them to kind of move past that.

46:14 And then they they take from it what they need and bring it to their world, right? So. And like, if you're listening, don't be discouraged, like, unless you feel sensitive to that being because some of those people often bring so much, like, brilliance, like some really young brilliant people and some older people, they're inspiring because they're coming back and trying something new.

46:36 Yeah. I actually love having a like a wide spectrum, you know, I, I get excited when there's multiple, like a lot of males, for example, you know, and we tend to attract more males in our trainings than the average yoga teacher training. I would say the average yoga teacher training that I work in is like 30 women and like maybe two men, maybe one man, right? Which is fine.

46:58 And we tend to get maybe five to, let's say 8:00 or so out of a flock of 30. And then I get excited when there's younger or older and just like a nice mix, right? Because then it's like, this is, this is what the world is, right? The world isn't just a bunch of skinny white people practicing yoga.

47:14 You know what I mean? Even though that's what the posters and Instagram looks like. It's like, no, everybody can practice yoga. Young, old, you know, big, small, weak, strong. You know, from a physical physique perspective, different religions, different backgrounds, like it doesn't matter, flexible. Inflexible.

47:30 Putting my hand up. Inflexible. Yeah, exactly. And a lot of people won't, but they won't even try yoga because they're like, I'm not flexible enough for that. And it's like, fair enough. They don't understand, right? But it, I think it's important for people to know that yoga is for everybody.

47:45 If they want it to be, if they want it, it is there for them. And yoga will receive you, right? It will not reject you, right? So I'll say that good. Cool. Last one I have, I'm going to read it silently first. OK yeah, this is probably relevant. So the word is depression.

48:08 And then for some, the intense focus on self-awareness and internal challenges can unearth past traumas and unresolved issues, potentially leading to depression or emotional upheaval. Yes, I feel like. This is your this is your wheelhouse right here.

48:27 Here we go. Yeah, look, this. Is a super important one because people who are already oppressed will go to yoga and it can. OK so my I've got so many thoughts about this. My mind's going 100 ways and I'm getting confused by them all. But it is a real risk.

48:55 So I'll start off with the idea of avoidance. We go through so much of life avoiding our emotions and we do that, you know, at regular life, through our phones, through it can be through exercise, it can be through healthy things.

49:11 We do it through watching Netflix, we do it through eating. It can be different for everyone, but we're constantly avoiding emotions. And I am saying pretty much everyone, some people manage not to. We can't acknowledge every emotion. So but it's just the degree to which you do it and most people are doing some level of avoidance because it's just easier and you need to get on with life. Sometimes you come to a yoga teacher training and you're going like you're stretching

49:39 your body in multiple ways every day, which brings up emotion. You're in a supportive environment or an environment which encourages expressing emotion. And you don't have to do all the things that you normally have to do. So you've got a lot of sort of space to sit there and think and get, get into your body and feel those emotions, which is great. But it can also be very confronting. And that can make you feel triggered, depressed, well, excited.

50:12 It can make you feel all sorts of things. This is, you know, you're focusing on depression. If it's a particularly, you know, negative emotions, and we're in that a lot, it can be very difficult to cope with. And you know, anecdotally, there's a lot of crying in yoga and teacher trainings. Like people are feeling things and they're getting through them.

50:30 And by and large, that's super positive. Like that's that you're getting to places that you haven't been and you're acknowledging things and those feelings give you a place from which to learn and change your life. But sometimes it's just a bit much like, you know, some people unwind a little bit and sometimes people find it a little bit hard. So it's, it's a real challenge.

50:54 And absolutely people can become depressed or, or overly depressed. And I just want to make that distinction that depression is a clinical condition where depressed thoughts or lack of joy exist for, you know, at least two weeks with a, a whole bunch of other accompanying symptoms. But everyone experienced depressed thoughts. So having depressed thoughts is normal and feeling down, you know, out of it, that's just a normal part of life. If that persists for many, many

51:27 weeks. And that's a problem. But yeah, this is, this is a risk, this is going to happen. But if it's, you know, a certain degree of feeling these is, is a positive thing. It's just that it with that with it can it can get a bit much for some people, yeah.

51:43 Yeah, I mean, it's intense, you know, the the training overall, why we're kind of that's basically, but it's the that intensity can lead to so many great things. This is the tapas, this is the the Niyama, the philosophy of like pressure, diamonds are made under pressure to some degree, right. But what we're also saying is that the risk or the caution there is that too much of anything is no good, no bueno, right?

52:10 Or at least a certain balance or possibly an integration or a pause or time for reflection in between the process is really important. So I'm not going too hard on everything. That's what I would say is because I, you know, I don't want to, I'm, I'm thinking like this podcast is very much about like highlighting a lot of the risk, which is kind of the intention.

52:32 But I also want the listeners to understand, especially if you haven't done the training before, like they're fantastic, like they're beautiful. There's reasons why thousands of people are doing that every single month in, in Bali here lift on more. So there's extreme benefit, but we also want to, we want to look at everything.

52:48 We want to look at all the perspectives and that helps people make the decisions for themselves and also reflect back on maybe the training that you had or the thing that you did. And you can just like start to like digest what was and then, you know, learn and grow from that.

53:01 And I think that's really important as well. Yeah. But just seeing, seeing, having seen so many trainings and the possibilities that exist there, It's like it's almost endless, to be honest, because of the containers can be so unique and special because the teachers, the, the space, the individuals and the peers that actually show up, that all is going to contribute to the experience to some degree. So it's, it's unique almost every single time. Every group is going to be

53:27 different. Every training is going to be different, even if it is with the same teachers. So it's, it's, you know, if you haven't done a training, I don't think everybody should do one. You know, I mean, I was told that years ago. I might even have mentioned it in one of the previous podcast episodes.

53:42 But everyone should do one in their lifetime to just experience it. Maybe you don't like it and you reject it, and that's fine. You get more clarity from that. But I would say there's, there's lots to be learned or something to take away from from doing a training like that.

53:55 And especially if you can do it in a place like Bali and you're in Bali for like 3 weeks and. Why not? I like that. Yeah. So given everything that we've talked about today, let's just try something. I know we haven't prepared this, but let's do top five tips to avoid the risks and to have make the most out of a yoga teacher training if you do it, and we'll just go one to one. Yeah, sure.

54:23 So we'll do five in total or 10 in total, or we'll do it until we run out. Let's. Start with six because that's three H OK, I'll put you on the spot and you, well, you get to go first. I get to. Thank you, I feel so special.

54:38 We're counting. Down from six folks, so top tip #6. OK, so ask me the question full throttle. Michael, what is your top tip for people about to start or wanting to start a yoga teacher training? I would say, and this is going to be difficult, I would say, but.

55:02 To get out, to get the most out of it, slash avoid the risks of it. Yeah, to to come into the experience in a way of being open, meaning receptive to learn to absorb, but also at the same time allowing yourself the permission to, I don't want to say question, but also have a certain boundary of that openness.

55:31 So like allow things to come in, but then also allow yourself to interpret that, right. And that basically means like try not to reject anything too quickly. Try not to accept anything too quickly either, right? So be open, but then also be you.

55:50 And I say that and I want to say I want to lean a little bit more towards like try to be a little bit more open mostly just because I see generally speaking, people are more closed, kind of like you said, avoiding certain things and stuff like that. So the openness will help create spice createspace or possibility for more.

56:05 But then all these, obviously we need to have certain boundaries and and we need to trust ourselves and what what's most appropriate for us so that we don't go too far and push too far. So it's a balance between those two. But I would say openness would be my number one. In summary, OK, yeah, I was like, wow, that's a big tip. Put me on the spot.

56:24 I got to give you the full throttle. I love it. Yeah. So openness, but have a boundary to openness. Yeah. Yeah, I love it. OK, good. All right. Next one I'm going to say eat well. I say that because you're putting yourself under intense pressure. Hopefully your yoga teacher training has good food provided, but if they don't have enough, make sure you go out and get some more good food because it is exhausting and as you know, you are what you eat.

57:00 I've just noticed a lot of people focus a lot on eating so get ready for it. If you're a big eater, bring some healthy protein bars and lots of snacks because it'll set you up for a good training. Yeah, take care of your root chakra. Yeah, your basic needs.

57:15 I feel like I could cheat with my next one and just say like make sure you sleep enough. But that's I I don't feel like that's I'll just, I'll give it to you. I'll be like add this to yours so #2 is and also sleep. Make sure you sleep enough. I get. 10 tips.

57:28 Rest enough so that just because, you know, it's so intense, like Brandon was saying earlier, like, you know, 7:00 AM to 6:00 PM, sometimes longer, sometimes earlier. So moments for period or moments of rest or moment periods of rejuvenation or recovery are super undervalued in the training. You know, if you're on the younger side, early 20s, then sure, maybe you have a little bit more Zing in your step, but generally speaking, you're going to eventually hit a wall. So the the more you can nurture

57:57 your needs again, the more you're going to kind of enjoy the experience overall. And I usually say this on days off, you know, try not try not to go to the beach or at least go to the beach for a little bit, but also have time for you to just rest. Allow your brain to do nothing.

58:10 Try to stay off your phone and social media if you can to allow your brain to just rest because it's a lot, OK? So I've got openness. Eat well and rest and yeah, rest. Like nourish yourself. Yeah, I have. Another one can I say?

58:25 One, yeah, please prepare, like give yourself the best chance to fully immerse into it. So what I mean is before you go into it, like let people know that you won't be quite as contactable, try to clear your work schedule.

58:43 You know, if you have friends or family that always need to talk to you, then maybe just try and reduce that a little bit to give yourself that space to, yeah, go through the process without too much outside influence. And so you're not like always stressed to make work calls and things.

58:59 So the more you can clear your schedule, the better a time you're going to have. So yeah. Yeah, so you can be more present there, absolutely more present there and and within reason, of course, if you have kids and stuff. But yeah, what I'm hearing you say is like try to set yourself up like you're going on vacation and take care of as many things as you can before you go on vacation. Slash do the training.

59:20 Yeah, yeah, that's good. That's a really good one actually. My next one is going to be about taking care of your physical needs, not just like eating and sleeping, but I'm talking about like depending on the type of training that you do, the physical demand and also the pushing into expanding your physical, let's say strength or flexibility. It's really exciting.

59:48 People often will do a training because they're like, I want to be stronger, I want to be more flexible and all those things. And that's great. But again, the body needs rest. The body needs to recover. And over a three-week period, there's going to be moments where you're going to need to sit out, you're going to need to opt out of this class.

1:00:02 You're going to need to rest because your wrists are sore, your knees are sore or whatever is sore, right? So allow yourself to listen to your body's needs. And even though it is this the teachers jobs to continue to push you. It's your job to say I'm OK for now, I'm going to take a break and they'll respect that.

1:00:19 And I, I can't imagine a teacher that would not respect a boundary about your physical needs of needing to take a break if you try to take like 3.3 days off in a row or something. And I'm not saying like don't show up to the training.

1:00:30 I'm saying like actually it just, it's OK if you don't physically practice, allow your body to rest if it needs to. And I see a lot of people pushing themselves especially in like Ashtanga or power yoga type of settings.

1:00:41 It's like go go, go. And it's like it's OK to just not. That's what. I'd say, yeah, it's not Hunger Games. Like look after yourself as part of the learning. Yeah, I'm going to say this in as a psychiatrist, if you have a mental health condition or a certain vulnerability to stress, two things, let someone know or your therapist or a good friend or your partner know that this is going to be a challenging time and you might need their support.

1:01:12 So I'd know I said like clear schedule. You might not talk to people, but at the same time you need to have some sort of supportive thing if you're getting that sort of overwhelm that some people get through it because you need like a fall back position someone that can support you. And also do not be afraid to speak up to the, the trainers, like I'm hoping that you trust the trainers or at least one of them to talk about it and do mention if you're feeling overwhelmed or it's getting a

1:01:40 bit much because there's all sorts of things like you can take some time off. They can hopefully find some people for you to talk to if that's needed, You can take, you know, you can just modify things as needed. So, but the most important things is to to speak up.

1:01:55 Don't suffer in your distress, whatever that is. Yeah, that's really good. I'm going to piggyback off that and just basically say like, don't be afraid to ask questions. Like ask questions if you don't know or you're not sure. Like everybody's there to learn.

1:02:09 So ask as as as many questions as you feel comfortable to do not too. Many of those anxiety questions, though? If you're a perfectionist, right? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah. And this is more that that that one's more so for the people that kind of are subjected to the crowd effect where you end up kind of hiding in the back.

1:02:29 It's like, don't, don't be afraid to engage. Engaging is going to enhance the experience. If you haven't asked a question in like a couple days, ask a question. Yeah. Or share. Something if you have something to share. Yeah, cool.

1:02:43 I think it's pretty good. Do you have anything? Else, well, use it. I mean, this is a general thing, but get to know as many people in your training as possible because there's some really cool people that come from all over the world to yoga teacher trainings like, you know, CE OS inspiring Youtubers, like true yogis, anyone like students, professionals, mothers, fathers, like whatever it is, you might see them in your yoga teacher training.

1:03:22 And it just kind of seems to attract a a group of very interesting people. So you use that opportunity. Yeah. You have something to learn probably from a lot of the people in every cohort because everyone is so unique in bringing some, some pool of teaching or wisdom with them. And if you're open to that, which was my number one, then you know, you could enhance your experience as well. Last one I'd say is just man, have some fun because they're so fun, right?

1:03:50 Enjoy, enjoy, have fun. Move your body, learn, ask questions if you want to, right? Rest, eat, laugh, challenge yourself. And then also create bound or like establish your boundaries or like honour your boundaries. Like just it's such a fun experience.

1:04:06 So if you've done it, you know that and you probably want to keep doing it. You haven't done it. Consider it. That's what I'd say, yeah. Yeah, love that. Good way to finish. Cool. All right. Well, that's all I got. How about you?

1:04:20 Yeah. Don, I feel pretty good. So this was great. This was a great series just to kind of wrap it up. So thank you everyone for tuning in over the last few weeks. And yeah, allowing us to just riff off of the yoga, the mental health, the well-being, kind of connecting some dots and some bridges.

1:04:36 And you know, Brendan and I love doing this. We want to be of service to you listening. So if you like some of the stuff that you want to reach out to, ask particular questions about any of the topics or things that we've said, you want to challenge us on some of the things like we love that. And if there's something that we didn't touch on that you'd be like, oh, it'd be really great if you address this or I experienced this.

1:04:56 What would that be kind of like? And we, you know, we'll totally get back on the mic and, and do that for you. So please feel free to reach out if you'd like to and ask a question. Yeah. Yeah, I, I echo that. Please, please do it.

1:05:07 And you know, we have, you've got the Going Pro Yoga podcast and I've got the selfie sake. And at the end of the day, those things are going towards similar outcomes. Like they're podcast to yoga as a thing that at its peak makes you as good a person as you can be.

1:05:28 And the self you seek is clearly that as well, like internally and externally. And you know, this is about sharing that experience. And yeah, we, we just like, I guess, promoting that. So, yeah, thank you very much for the series. It's been really good.

1:05:44 Yeah. I agree. Thank you, Brandon. Cool. All right. Otherwise for for us or at least for me, I guess I'll speak to some of you next week and for Brandon, I'll probably talk to you later today. Otherwise, yeah. Thank you so much, Brandon.

1:06:00 I appreciate you. Thanks. Michael, cheers. OK. All right. Thanks everyone. We'll see you next week. All right, before you go, let me just tell you about the going proyoga.com platform O right now you can go to goingroyogacom and check it out for free for seven days where you can actually learn more about yoga in the ways of alignment, queuing, sequencing, yoga anatomy.

1:06:20 So that if you've done a 200 hour teacher training and you want to continue to learn ractice and grow, this latform is definitely for you. So I definitely suggest checking it outgoingroyogacom right now. You can try it out for free for seven days.